plan 439Clean Water For 2,600

Summary

Clean Water For 2,600 seeks to enable sustainable safe drinking water for 2,600 children, students and families in 6-7 San Joaquin Valley communities with high levels of nitrate and arsenic groundwater contamination.

Background

One million people in California lack reliable access to clean water. Contaminated drinking water causes gastrointestinal illnesses, nervous or reproductive system impacts, and chronic diseases such as cancer.

3 out of 4 Californians with nitrate-contaminated drinking water live in the San Joaquin Valley. In 2007, nearly 300,000 people in the San Joaquin Valley drank water that violated the arsenic health standard.

Most of this is attributable to the contamination of the region’s groundwater by decades of intensive agricultural operations. Pesticides and fertilizers (primarily nitrates) from farms and mega-dairies contaminate groundwater basins, upon which 90% of communities in the San Joaquin Valley rely for drinking water. Most of the communities without safe drinking water are also the most politically underrepresented communities, left out of local, regional and state water planning and funding processes.

One in 10 people living in California's agricultural areas is at risk of exposure to harmful levels of nitrate contamination in their drinking water, according to a report released on March 13, 2012 by the University of California, Davis.
http://caes.ucdavis.edu/NewsEvents/spotlight/addressing-nitrate-in-californiasdrinking-water/?searchterm=california%20water%20nitrates

The report concluded that directly removing nitrate from groundwater basins is extremely costly and not technically feasible. It recommends drinking water supply actions, such as water treatment and alternative water supplies, as the most cost-effective way forward. This conclusion supports our program, i.e. provide alternative water filtration solutions with sustainable support and financing, so that children, families and communities stay healthy NOW, while longer-term initiatives tackle the agricultural and political causes of the San Joaquin Valley water crisis.

While there has been a lot of progress helping to develop long-term solutions for communities, there is very little funding for interim solutions necessary to keep families safe in the years that it takes to develop and implement long-term solutions. This project would focus on piloting different models of interim solutions and making them more accessible and available to communities.

San Joaquin Valley, California’s “bread basket” is the seat of our Clean Water for 2,600 Program. 6-7 communities in Kern, Tulare and Fresno Counties will be selected as representative of the broader Valley population. The hope is that, as a result, we can leverage the learning of this program and scale it across the entire Valley.

The communities to be empowered by this program will be selected based on 1) how severe their shortage of safe drinking water is; 2) the number of young children living in the community; and 3) the location of daycare centers and schools that could make clean water available for many.

The people we serve live in housing not connected to county water infrastructure. They, therefore, depend on wells that draw groundwater that has been polluted by agricultural pesticides, animal fecal matter and naturally occurring arsenic.

These communities are largely low-income agricultural and migrant workers. 50-60% of the population is of Hispanic origin, but the percentage in the selected communities will be higher. The per capita income in the 3 counties is $14,000-$16,000 and 21-24% live under the poverty line. 30+% of the population is under 18 years old.

Location

communities in Tulare, Fresno, Kings and Kern Counties, California, United States

Focus

Primary Focus: Drinking Water - Schools
Secondary Focus: Drinking Water - Community

People Getting Safe Drinking Water: 2,600

Approximately 100 low-income, primarily Latino farmworker families, and approximately 4 day care and 4 public school facilities serving children of predominately Latino farmworker families.

School Children Getting Water: 2,200

Approximately 4 day care and 4 public school facilities serving children of predominately Latino farmworker families.

People Getting Sanitation: 0

People Getting Other Benefits:

Start Date: 2012-10-01

Completion Date: 2013-09-30

Technology Used:

Clean Water For 2,600 combines cost-efficient water filtration systems with a community engagement program to ensure sustainability.

Extensive surveying will determine the program communities. We will pilot two solutions:

1) Under-the-sink reverse osmosis units for households with nitrate or arsenic contamination.

2) High-volume reverse osmosis vending filtration systems for daycare centers and schools with nitrate or arsenic contamination.

The Community Water Center and community representatives will develop an education, installation training and monitoring program to ensure the clean water system delivered is sustainable and economic to operate.

CWC will work with the selected communities to develop the specific interim solutions program for their community in order to ensure they are prepared to take full advantage of the water filtration systems and organized to manage and maintain them. The communities will be involved in all phases of the program to develop and support long-term commitment and leadership within the community itself. CWC plans to start in communities where we have well-established community organization and capacity-building programs to lead the first few programs.

Specifically, we plan to start with the installation of 101 household-based and four school-based community water filters. By combining household and school-based water filters, we will enable the greatest number of people to gain access to safe drinking water. The project also includes money for water testing both to ensure the appropriate filters are selected to address current water quality needs, as well as to test the water post-filtration to ensure the devices are performing.

Phases:

We will start with two communities with different models of solutions as pilots (one school-based and and one in-homes under the sink). Then we will conduct evaluations of those efforts and do project development in the remaining areas.

Community Organization:

Each community is different and so each project will have to develop a customized solution for ownership and on-going monitoring and maintenance as part of the community's project development and implementation plan. However, in each community the filtration unit will be owned and operated either by the school or day care facility itself, the local public water system, individual households, or a community -based group of residents. These issues are the most important and time consuming in terms of community outreach and project development and implementation and will be a focus of the evaluation for each project, and particularly for the pilots.

Government Interaction:

This project is supported by the many local government entities in the region, but fills a gap in existing funding sources. Government funding sources are available for long-term more permanent solutions but require significant planning time and costs to implement. In the meantime, communities without safe water have to wait years to access safe drinking water. This project seeks to provide an interim solution for the years that they community is working through existing government systems to fund community-wide more permanent drinking water solutions.

Ancillary activities:

Other Issues:

Maintenance Revenue:

Evaluation of the project is vital to ensuring that the interim solution models are accomplishing their goals and informing how they can be replicated or adjusted in many more communities. Specifically, we will conduct a survey before and after the project, analyze and write up an evaluation based on surveys and results, and develop case studies and reports for each community to help with replication in other areas.

Maintenance Cost:

Metrics:

1) Installation of appropriate water filter technology.
2) Achievement of water quality that meets all Safe Drinking Water Act requirements for all regulated contaminants, and particularly elimination of exceedences of water quality standards for nitrate and arsenic.
3) Decreased exposure to and consumption of nitrate or arsenic contaminated water for all 2600 students, children and families.
4) Increased savings of at least 25% by schools, daycares, and families on potable water costs.
5) Increased consumption of safe water by students, children and families.
6) Increased focus and investment in safe drinking water access in schools and low-income communities by funding, research, and policy-making entities.

Cost: $115,200

Outreach Training and Education: $6,955
Community Project Development Planning & Support: $5,100
Water Testing: $5,000
Water Filtration Systems & Installation:$62,520
Project Evaluation & Documentation: $25,398
Indirect Project Costs: $10,227

Co Funding Amount:

Community Contribution Amount: $15,200

Local community for under-the-sink filtration systems for one community.

Fund Requested: $100,000

  • 1 participant | show more

    Metrics and long-term assessment

    Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

    In the "Metrics to be Measured" section, we want a list of measurable and trackable impacts you hope to achieve. Maybe it was not clear, but we are looking for specific metrics about operating status you will track at some frequency after project implementation. As stated "PWX will soon offer the ability to track metrics (at differing f...

    In the "Metrics to be Measured" section, we want a list of measurable and trackable impacts you hope to achieve.

    Maybe it was not clear, but we are looking for specific metrics about operating status you will track at some frequency after project implementation. As stated "PWX will soon offer the ability to track metrics (at differing frequency) to learn about actual operation and assess impact" with some examples.

    Here are my questions regarding the metrics you mentioned:

    1) Installation of appropriate water filter technology. implementation not monitoring.
    2) Achievement of water quality that meets all Safe Drinking Water Act requirements for all regulated contaminants, and particularly elimination of exceedences of water quality standards for nitrate and arsenic. Is this a one-time activity or repeated long term?
    3) Decreased exposure to and consumption of nitrate or arsenic contaminated water for all 2600 students, children and families. Do you have good numbers on current exposure? How often will you be testing? Seems related to #2.
    4) Increased savings of at least 25% by schools, daycares, and families on potable water costs. Do you have baseline costs? Will this be a one-time survey or repeated (at least till the goal is achieved)?
    5) Increased consumption of safe water by students, children and families. Is this a measurable trackable statistic? A laudable goal, but we are focused on graphable metrics.
    6) Increased focus and investment in safe drinking water access in schools and low-income communities by funding, research, and policy-making entities. Maybe you can track investment, will you?

    Thanks,
    Rajesh

  • 1 participant | show more

    Arsenic filtration and Waste disposal

    Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

    If arsenic is present, very few filters reduce to 10ppb - most reduce to 50ppb depending on initial level - what is the initial contaminatin level? How are you going to dispose of these membranes? Arsenic will find its way into the biosphere - water, food, ... - if not disposed off properly. How do you plan to dispose of the used membra...

    If arsenic is present, very few filters reduce to 10ppb - most reduce to 50ppb depending on initial level - what is the initial contaminatin level?

    How are you going to dispose of these membranes? Arsenic will find its way into the biosphere - water, food, ... - if not disposed off properly. How do you plan to dispose of the used membranes?

    If the membranes are cleaned by backwash, this also introduces arsenic laced water into the waste water stream. Something to think about.

    Regards,
    Rajesh

  • 1 participant | show more

    Community/household selection

    Meena Palaniappan of Pacific Institute

    Laurel, I think this is a great project, congratulations on moving forward to address these critical issues with solutions. What criteria will you use to select the communities, and within one community, how will you decide which 100 households will receive the system? It seems that the model of deploying it through child-care centers a...

    Laurel,

    I think this is a great project, congratulations on moving forward to address these critical issues with solutions. What criteria will you use to select the communities, and within one community, how will you decide which 100 households will receive the system? It seems that the model of deploying it through child-care centers and schools could have a much greater impact. Additionally, could a model to pilot a "community center" type of RO system be useful to explore? Many elementary schools serve as gathering places for the community and resource centers for community needs--could an RO system in such a place serve a larger number of people? You may want to look at the Water Health Centres model (http://www.waterhealth.com/) as an interesting model of community water treatment centers.

    Best luck for success in your efforts,
    Meena

  • 3 participants | show more

    RO water treatment

    Gemma Bulos of Global Women's Water Initiative

    Hi there So glad to see a program in the US - further indicating that the water crisis is all around us and not just in the developing world. kudos to your work! I had a question about reverse osmosis and why you chose that technology. Is that the only technology available that will provide the kind of treatment that you need? I have...

    Hi there

    So glad to see a program in the US - further indicating that the water crisis is all around us and not just in the developing world. kudos to your work!

    I had a question about reverse osmosis and why you chose that technology. Is that the only technology available that will provide the kind of treatment that you need? I have very basic knowledge about RO. It is my understanding the RO wastes alot of water during treatment. If there is a water shortage issue in the region, do you have a strategy to reuse the excess 'waste' water from the RO process?

    Please enlighten me! I would love to learn more about your research!

    Be well
    Gemma

    • Laurel Firestone of Community Water Center

      California Department of Public Health generates a list of certified filters for each contaminate yearly; we will be choosing filters/treatment devises from this list. It is important that we use the best known devices to treat Nitrates and Arsenic. Reverse Osmosis is the more commonly known and used technology to treat these contaminants,...

      California Department of Public Health generates a list of certified filters for each contaminate yearly; we will be choosing filters/treatment devises from this list. It is important that we use the best known devices to treat Nitrates and Arsenic. Reverse Osmosis is the more commonly known and used technology to treat these contaminants, and it is also what CDPH has deemed able to deal with these containments.

      It is important to note that we will be connecting to only one tap in each home and not to every tap in the house, therefore we will only be losing excess water from one tap. Although water shortage is not an issue, we do promote water conservation. We will defiantly search through CDPH’s list to whether there are other technology options.

    • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

      I am no expert on RO, but it is easy enough to get this info from the internet. One Perspective: Osmosis systems apparently have numerous advantages. They are friendly to the environment, as they do not produce or use any harmful chemicals during the process. These systems also require a minimal amount of power. Reverse osmosis system...

      I am no expert on RO, but it is easy enough to get this info from the internet.

      One Perspective: Osmosis systems apparently have numerous advantages. They are friendly to the environment, as they do not produce or use any harmful chemicals during the process. These systems also require a minimal amount of power. Reverse osmosis systems work well in home filtration systems because they are typically small in size.

      Taste of the purified water is another distinct advantage. Reverse osmosis removes dissolved minerals and other contaminants that cause water to smell unpleasant, taste poorly and take on unusual colors.

      Removal of dissolved minerals, metals and other particles benefits plumbing systems. There is nothing in the water to corrode pipes or collect as sediment.

      Disadvantages
      Reverse osmosis treatments require an enormous amount of water. Such systems typically return as little as 5 to 15 percent of the water pushed through the system, which means it also takes a long time to properly treat the water. What's left then exits the system as wastewater. This amount of wastewater can burden home septic systems. Water entering the reverse osmosis system should also be free of bacteria. While reverse osmosis systems do remove nearly all microorganisms, the risk of contamination through tiny leaks or deteriorating parts prevents reverse osmosis systems from being used to remove bacteria.

      Read more: Advantages & Disadvantages of Reverse Osmosis | eHow.com.

      Another perspective is:

      Wasted Water and Electricity Bills
      Reverse osmosis only renders about 5 to 15 percent of the water entering the system drinkable. The low percentage of efficiency creates a great deal of wasted water--potentially 40 to 90 gallons of waste water for every 5 usable gallons--which can add a significant amount of waste for houses using septic systems.

      Furthermore, the inefficiency of a reverse osmosis filtration system may also cause electricity bills to increase.

      Lack of Filtration Specificity
      Because reverse osmosis removes chemicals and contaminants based purely on size, the process can remove minerals like iron and manganese that the human body obtains mostly from drinking water in addition to harmful contaminants like lead, mercury and salt. Though not a common problem with reverse osmotic systems, it is also possible for small particles and bacteria to pass through the semi-permeable membrane.

      Storage
      Reverse osmotic water systems require a place to store water. Such storage units must be frequently disinfected, as the moist environment provides ideal conditions for bacteria to grow.

      Read more: The Disadvantages of Reverse Osmosis | eHow.com

    • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

      I think that it would be a huge waste of money to spend PWX funds in the U.S., where everything is much more expensive. Rick

      I think that it would be a huge waste of money to spend PWX funds in the U.S., where everything is much more expensive. Rick

      • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

        Just to make it a bit more clear about the cost and complexity of establishing a new water system in California, I asked my wife who unlike me, actually is a California state-qualified water engineer, and she told me about the list of what needs to be approved to build even a small urban water system in California. So here is a brief ...

        Just to make it a bit more clear about the cost and complexity of establishing a new water system in California, I asked my wife who unlike me, actually is a California state-qualified water engineer, and she told me about the list of what needs to be approved to build even a small urban water system in California.

        So here is a brief list of the various legal, technical, and engineering issues that need to be taken into account before you stick a shovel in the ground:

        - Environmental Impact Statement;
        - State and Local Government Approval of any water source utilization;
        - Hydrology Survey;
        - Wildlife Impact Survey (reducing people's impacts on water consumption;
        - Acquiring access to new water sources is exceptionally complex and costly.

        Then there is the California Environmental Quality Act

        The California Environmental Quality Act (CEQA) is a California statute passed in 1970, shortly after the United States federal government passed the National Environmental Policy Act (NEPA), to institute a statewide policy of environmental protection. CEQA does not directly regulate land uses, but instead requires state and local agencies within California to follow a protocol of analysis and public disclosure of environmental impacts of proposed projects and adopt all feasible measures to mitigate those impacts.[1] CEQA makes environmental protection a mandatory part of every California state and local agency's decision making process. It has also become the basis for numerous lawsuits concerning public and private projects.

        Contents [hide]
        1 Policy
        2 CEQA process overview
        2.1 Lead agency and responsible agencies
        2.2 Initial study
        2.3 Thresholds of significance
        3 Environmental impact analysis
        3.1 Aesthetics
        3.2 Agricultural resources
        3.3 Air quality
        3.4 Biological resources
        3.5 Geology and soils
        3.6 Greenhouse gases
        3.6.1 Introduction and setting
        3.6.2 Analysis approach
        3.6.2.1 Bay Area Air Quality Management District
        3.6.2.2 South Coast Air Quality Management District
        3.6.2.3 Impact mitigation measures
        3.7 Hazards and hazardous materials
        3.8 Hydrology and water quality
        3.9 Land use and planning
        3.10 Mineral resources
        3.11 Noise
        3.12 Population and housing
        3.13 Public services
        3.14 Recreation
        3.15 Transportation and traffic
        3.16 Utilities
        3.17 Mandatory findings of significance
        4 Level of environmental review
        4.1 Ministerial decision
        4.2 Statutory exemptions
        4.3 Categorical exemptions
        4.4 Negative Declaration/ Mitigated Negative Declaration
        4.5 Environmental Impact Report
        5 Comparisons to similar laws
        5.1 National Environmental Policy Act
        5.2 Laws in other states
        6 Litigation
        6.1 Complaints
        6.2 Settlements
        7 See also
        8 References
        9 Further reading

        By the way, in California rights is exceptionally sensitive and complex to access water. You might want to watch the movie Chinatown.

        Believe me, you do not want to try and establish a new water system in California.

        Cheers, Rick

    • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

      Just to make it a bit more clear about the cost and complexity of establishing a new water system in California, I asked my wife who unlike me, actually is a California state-qualified water engineer, and she told me about the list of what needs to be approved to build even a small urban water system in California. So here is a brief ...

      Just to make it a bit more clear about the cost and complexity of establishing a new water system in California, I asked my wife who unlike me, actually is a California state-qualified water engineer, and she told me about the list of what needs to be approved to build even a small urban water system in California.

      So here is a brief list of the various legal, technical, and engineering issues that need to be taken into account before you stick a shovel in the ground:

      - Environmental Impact Statement;
      - State and Local Government Approval of any water source utilization;
      - Hydrology Survey;
      - Wildlife Impact Survey (reducing people's impacts on water consumption;
      - Acquiring access to new water sources is exceptionally complex and costly.

      Then there is the California Environmental Quality Act

      The California Environmental Quality Act (CEQA) is a California statute passed in 1970, shortly after the United States federal government passed the National Environmental Policy Act (NEPA), to institute a statewide policy of environmental protection. CEQA does not directly regulate land uses, but instead requires state and local agencies within California to follow a protocol of analysis and public disclosure of environmental impacts of proposed projects and adopt all feasible measures to mitigate those impacts.[1] CEQA makes environmental protection a mandatory part of every California state and local agency's decision making process. It has also become the basis for numerous lawsuits concerning public and private projects.

      Contents [hide]
      1 Policy
      2 CEQA process overview
      2.1 Lead agency and responsible agencies
      2.2 Initial study
      2.3 Thresholds of significance
      3 Environmental impact analysis
      3.1 Aesthetics
      3.2 Agricultural resources
      3.3 Air quality
      3.4 Biological resources
      3.5 Geology and soils
      3.6 Greenhouse gases
      3.6.1 Introduction and setting
      3.6.2 Analysis approach
      3.6.2.1 Bay Area Air Quality Management District
      3.6.2.2 South Coast Air Quality Management District
      3.6.2.3 Impact mitigation measures
      3.7 Hazards and hazardous materials
      3.8 Hydrology and water quality
      3.9 Land use and planning
      3.10 Mineral resources
      3.11 Noise
      3.12 Population and housing
      3.13 Public services
      3.14 Recreation
      3.15 Transportation and traffic
      3.16 Utilities
      3.17 Mandatory findings of significance
      4 Level of environmental review
      4.1 Ministerial decision
      4.2 Statutory exemptions
      4.3 Categorical exemptions
      4.4 Negative Declaration/ Mitigated Negative Declaration
      4.5 Environmental Impact Report
      5 Comparisons to similar laws
      5.1 National Environmental Policy Act
      5.2 Laws in other states
      6 Litigation
      6.1 Complaints
      6.2 Settlements
      7 See also
      8 References
      9 Further reading

      By the way, in California rights is exceptionally sensitive and complex to access water. You might want to watch the movie Chinatown.

      Believe me, you do not want to try and establish a new water system in California.

      Cheers, Rick

  • 4 participants | show more

    Jenna Saldaña of El Porvenir

    Hi, I find this really interesting as I'm so used to focusing on water needs in developing countries. A couple questions come to mind as I read through the application. 1. Is there any work being done to reduce/eliminate the use of nitrates/fertilizer on the farms? You write that the local governments are committed to addressing the ...

    Hi,
    I find this really interesting as I'm so used to focusing on water needs in developing countries. A couple questions come to mind as I read through the application.

    1. Is there any work being done to reduce/eliminate the use of nitrates/fertilizer on the farms? You write that the local governments are committed to addressing the water problem long-term, but really the problem is the contamination, no? if you could reduce that, then you could eliminate the need for any water system. This is not to say that your project isn't needed, and I realize that government moves slowly, but I wonder about addressing the root cause of the problem.

    2. How much maintenance would be needed for the under the sink units? Are they complicated systems? I'm guessing that the farm workers work long days and come home tired. Is it reasonable to think that they would have the time to deal with any maintenance concerns?

    3. What is the buy in from the community members? I see there is a "local community contribution" of $15,000--is that from the people or the local government?

    4. How did this project come about? Did it begin with concern from the parents and residents about the contamination?

    5. How much experience do you all have in installing this type of system?

    Sorry for all the questions; I'm quite interested to learn from you about this and see how it all turns out.

    Jenna

    • Erin Huber of Drink Local. Drink Tap.

      Hello, I was wondering if there have been attempts to get some of these materials in kind (transport in the states is easier than shipping abroad to water projects and there are companies stateside that develop these materials/systems). Also, in the budget, the project evaluation fees consists of what and are completed by whom? What are ...

      Hello,
      I was wondering if there have been attempts to get some of these materials in kind (transport in the states is easier than shipping abroad to water projects and there are companies stateside that develop these materials/systems). Also, in the budget, the project evaluation fees consists of what and are completed by whom? What are indirect costs covering?

      Thanks,
      Erin

      • Laurel Firestone of Community Water Center

        We will be partnering with local stores and business as much as possible. Due to the volume of devices that we will be purchasing, we will get them at a discounted rate. We will be partnering with local businesses and clubs, such as the rotary clubs, for in kind donations of time, physical labor and any additional support that is needed. ...

        We will be partnering with local stores and business as much as possible. Due to the volume of devices that we will be purchasing, we will get them at a discounted rate. We will be partnering with local businesses and clubs, such as the rotary clubs, for in kind donations of time, physical labor and any additional support that is needed.

        As for evaluation, because this is the first time that a project like this has been done, it is extremely important to document and evaluate the process. CWC have a research scientist on staff that has already begun to do surveying as part of the evaluation process.

    • Laurel Firestone of Community Water Center

      We will be partnering with local stores and business as much as possible. Due to the volume of devices that we will be purchasing, we will get them at a discounted rate. We will be partnering with local businesses and clubs, such as the rotary clubs, for in kind donations of time, physical labor and any additional support that is needed. ...

      We will be partnering with local stores and business as much as possible. Due to the volume of devices that we will be purchasing, we will get them at a discounted rate. We will be partnering with local businesses and clubs, such as the rotary clubs, for in kind donations of time, physical labor and any additional support that is needed.

      As for evaluation, because this is the first time that a project like this has been done, it is extremely important to document and evaluate the process. CWC have a research scientist on staff that has already begun to do surveying as part of the evaluation process.

    • Laurel Firestone of Community Water Center

      That is a great question! We defiantly agree that we should be working towards addressing the root causes of the problem. The Community Water Center currently coordinates and provides staff to the AGUA Coalition (la Asociación de Gente Unida por el Agua, or the Association of People United for Water). AGUA is a grassroots coalition of ...

      That is a great question! We defiantly agree that we should be working towards addressing the root causes of the problem. The Community Water Center currently coordinates and provides staff to the AGUA Coalition (la Asociación de Gente Unida por el Agua, or the Association of People United for Water).

      AGUA is a grassroots coalition of impacted community residents and allied non-profit organizations, founded in early February 2006 to push for regional solutions to larger systemic water problems including groundwater pollution.

      AGUA’s current campaign focuses on securing effective groundwater protection for drinking water sources, particularly from nitrate contamination. This campaign focuses on advocacy at the Central Valley Regional Water Quality Control Board, as well as with state and local representatives. As a result of these efforts, the Regional Water Quality Control Board unveiled its proposed regulatory program for all 7 million acres of irrigated agricultural land in the Central Valley, which for the first time will focus on protecting both surface and groundwater quality. Currently, ag lands are covered under a conditional waiver that monitors surface water quality only.
      For more information on the actual work that the center is doing to aggress root causes, please visit our website www.communitywatercenter.org

      Q. How much maintenance would be needed for the under the sink units? Are they complicated systems? I'm guessing that the farm workers work long days and come home tired. Is it reasonable to think that they would have the time to deal with any maintenance concerns?

      A. The under the sink filters are not complicated systems. We will assist residents with the initial installation process. Typically the maintenance process consists of simply changing the filter every 3-4 months, the filters literally snap on and off. Also, the system has a light that will flash as an indicator that it is almost time to replace the filter.

      Q. What is the buy in from the community members? I see there is a "local community contribution" of $15,000--is that from the people or the local government?

      A. The local contribution is from the local Rotary clubs, they have begun to show interested in local water contamination issues and they have committed $15,000 of funds towards interim solutions in the San Joaquin Valley.

      Q. How did this project come about? Did it begin with concern from the parents and residents about the contamination?

      A. CWC has been working towards long term solutions for over 6 years. Unfortunately long term solutions can take over a decade to get, meanwhile there is no funding for interim solution projects and people are forced to seek and pay for their own solutions, which in most cases means paying twice for water, once for a water bill for water they can’t drink and again for alternative water sources. CWC will be implementing these interim solutions in some of communities that we already working in. The community residents have been concerned with their water quality for many years, a short term solution such as this, is the only solution that they can look forward to for now.

      Q. How much experience do you all have in installing this type of system?

      A. None. Installation is not our area of expertise or area of focus. We recognize the importance of the proper and correct installation of these systems, therefore we will be partnering with local experts who will provide installation, training, and support.

    • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

      This issue of excessive fertilizer can sometimes be a significant problem here in Vermont, as it shows up in Lake Champlain as "green slime", which can sicken animals who drink it.

      This issue of excessive fertilizer can sometimes be a significant problem here in Vermont, as it shows up in Lake Champlain as "green slime", which can sicken animals who drink it.

    • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

      This issue of excessive fertilizer can sometimes be a significant problem here in Vermont, as it shows up in Lake Champlain as "green slime", which can sicken animals who drink it.

      This issue of excessive fertilizer can sometimes be a significant problem here in Vermont, as it shows up in Lake Champlain as "green slime", which can sicken animals who drink it.

    • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

      Local community contributions means that all of the community members (except for those who are physically or financial simply) unable to make these contributions) must agree to provide up to some specific percentage of the overall construction costs, as well as providing financial and/or labor and local materials to support the ongoing op...

      Local community contributions means that all of the community members (except for those who are physically or financial simply) unable to make these contributions) must agree to provide up to some specific percentage of the overall construction costs, as well as providing financial and/or labor and local materials to support the ongoing operation, maintenance and repair costs over the lifetime of the system. If this is not adhered to, it is very likely that the system will fail. One other very important point is that there must be a leader (male or female) within the community who will ensure that these requirements are met.

      Construction costs can include any combination of labor (e.g., digging pipeline trenches, providing local materials, e.g., sand, stone, lumber, etc. for construction, as well being able to finance long term operation and maintenance costs. No free loaders should be allowed, except in special circumstances such as for families of very old, or indigent people (without personal family resources support to sustain them).

      This may sound somewhat draconian (especially for old people), but it is socially very important that every potential beneficiary should be responsible to provide at least some modest support to build, operate and maintain the system, otherwise it is very likely that the system will fail.

  • 5 participants | show more

    Interim solution?

    Dipti Vaghela of Team Blue

    Hi Community Water Center, Great to hear about the context of your work and the momentum you are building locally. A major concern I have is that you state this would be an interim solution: "This project seeks to provide an interim solution for the years that they community is working through existing government systems to fund c...

    Hi Community Water Center,

    Great to hear about the context of your work and the momentum you are building locally.

    A major concern I have is that you state this would be an interim solution:

    "This project seeks to provide an interim solution for the years that they community is working through existing government systems to fund community-wide more permanent drinking water solutions."

    My concern is what would happen to the infrastructure you invest in after the permanent solution comes. Does it make sense to invest so much resource and effort in what you envision as a temporary solution? Is there a way to ensure that project becomes part of a permanent solution? Can you please clarify?

    Thank you,
    Dipti

    • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

      I have been on a trip for several months, and so my response is somewhat of a last minute last minute response to this proposal. Four of the most important issues that are not given much attention are operation, maintenance, regulatory and financing. For operation, who will manage the overall operation of the system? This is no going to...

      I have been on a trip for several months, and so my response is somewhat of a last minute last minute response to this proposal. Four of the most important issues that are not given much attention are operation, maintenance, regulatory and financing. For operation, who will manage the overall operation of the system? This is no going to be a small system such as many of the previous PWX sites. It will likely be relatively more expensive and complex. This is in part due to much more complex technical requirements (and subsequent complexity) higher cost per water volume, environmental and legal requirements in the U.S. context. Although other reviewers expressed a positive opinion in building a U.S. based PWX site, I do not share that opinion. In terms of cost (legal, quality of materials, operational staff, technical and operational complexity). It will no doubt result in much less bang for your buck.

      Therefore, I strongly recommend that the very limited PWX financing continue to be used strictly outside the U.S. (or any other developed country).

      • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

        Sorry about shooting this down, but I just want to get the biggest "Bang for our Buck".

        Sorry about shooting this down, but I just want to get the biggest "Bang for our Buck".

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          Sorry to say, but the proposed California project would be a disaster for the Peer Water Exchange. Cheers, Rick

          Sorry to say, but the proposed California project would be a disaster for the Peer Water Exchange.

          Cheers, Rick

          • Meena Palaniappan of Pacific Institute

            I want to offer another perspective. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of people within the richest country in the world who live in third world or worse conditions is truly a tragedy. While there are international institutions, thousands of international NGOs, and billions of dollars focused on the severe problems of lack of s...

            I want to offer another perspective. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of people within the richest country in the world who live in third world or worse conditions is truly a tragedy. While there are international institutions, thousands of international NGOs, and billions of dollars focused on the severe problems of lack of safe water and sanitation in developing countries, we simply do not have the same level of attention or resources focused on these critical issues in the United States. The work of the Community Water Center is really unique and badly needed. I've worked at length on environmental justice issues in the United States, and documented how certain communities--primarily the poor and people of color--bear the brunt of toxic pollution. The same is true in developing country cities, an issue I've also worked on for decades, where it is the very poor who don't have access to the same subsidized municipal water as the middle class. We need to address water poverty and water inequity everywhere in the world. To term this an interim solution is a misnomer I think. Changing water policy and the practices of large agriculture in California will be a many decades effort. These communities need solutions now. Both need to be pursued in concert. And, solutions that were mostly used in developing countries (sink attached RO units--widely used in Asia in developing country cities by the middle class) are now filling a niche here in the US. I am not a huge fan of RO, but I do feel RO is well suited to deal with nitrate contamination, for which there are not a lot of good solutions. Best, Meena

            • Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

              Rick, Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you: 1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for...

              Rick,

              Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you:

              1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for many reasons.

              2. The capacity and ability of CWC to deliver on this project. Their background in mobilizing is good, but this is new teritory for them. Seeing their (lack of) interaction in the Q&A does generate doubt.

              But here are 2 questions for you:

              1. We are tapping into funds that are California specific. So they could not be used elsewhere. In this case, its not a choice of using funds here or somewhere else which maybe could be seen as more deserving. Even if we ignore Meena's perspective, shouldn't such funds being used in CA provide a great 'bang for the buck'?

              2. Why do you think this project would be a disaster for PWX?

              In fact, PWX provides a platform with SMS, mapping, and project verification to help track the implementation and operation of even household systems. The PWX network can provide support and feedback.

              If there is some serious pitfall PWX is heading into, please be more explicit. This is why the PWX process is great, your experience and insight (and that of so many peers with diverse experiences) may help avoid a trap.

              Finally, i think that even if the project does not succeed, PWX will record failed attempts, an activity sorely lacking the water sector. Failures provide a rich set of learnings if viewed in full context. Such transparency is not even imagined by the new momentum that is getting attention and funding in the sector. Right now all the focus is on failed projects with no context of who did them, when, and why. PWX is the only place a failure is not just a point on the map, but is put in context of the plan, the organization, the work attempted, and the jury is not a funder but a set of peers who care about fixing the entire process to change the outcome.

              Regards,
              Rajesh

              • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

                Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

                Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

                • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                  Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

                  Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

                  In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

                  Cheers, Rick

                  • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                    What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                    What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                    By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                    Cheers, Rick

                    Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                    Rick

                • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                  What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                  What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                  By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                  Cheers, Rick

                  Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                  Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

                Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

                In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

                Cheers, Rick

                • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                  What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                  What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                  By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                  Cheers, Rick

                  Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                  Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

              Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

              Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

                Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

                In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

                Cheers, Rick

                • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                  What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                  What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                  By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                  Cheers, Rick

                  Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                  Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

              In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

              Cheers, Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

            Rick, Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you: 1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for...

            Rick,

            Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you:

            1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for many reasons.

            2. The capacity and ability of CWC to deliver on this project. Their background in mobilizing is good, but this is new teritory for them. Seeing their (lack of) interaction in the Q&A does generate doubt.

            But here are 2 questions for you:

            1. We are tapping into funds that are California specific. So they could not be used elsewhere. In this case, its not a choice of using funds here or somewhere else which maybe could be seen as more deserving. Even if we ignore Meena's perspective, shouldn't such funds being used in CA provide a great 'bang for the buck'?

            2. Why do you think this project would be a disaster for PWX?

            In fact, PWX provides a platform with SMS, mapping, and project verification to help track the implementation and operation of even household systems. The PWX network can provide support and feedback.

            If there is some serious pitfall PWX is heading into, please be more explicit. This is why the PWX process is great, your experience and insight (and that of so many peers with diverse experiences) may help avoid a trap.

            Finally, i think that even if the project does not succeed, PWX will record failed attempts, an activity sorely lacking the water sector. Failures provide a rich set of learnings if viewed in full context. Such transparency is not even imagined by the new momentum that is getting attention and funding in the sector. Right now all the focus is on failed projects with no context of who did them, when, and why. PWX is the only place a failure is not just a point on the map, but is put in context of the plan, the organization, the work attempted, and the jury is not a funder but a set of peers who care about fixing the entire process to change the outcome.

            Regards,
            Rajesh

            • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

              Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

              Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

                Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

                In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

                Cheers, Rick

                • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                  What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                  What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                  By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                  Cheers, Rick

                  Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                  Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

              In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

              Cheers, Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

              In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

              Cheers, Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Meena Palaniappan of Pacific Institute

          I want to offer another perspective. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of people within the richest country in the world who live in third world or worse conditions is truly a tragedy. While there are international institutions, thousands of international NGOs, and billions of dollars focused on the severe problems of lack of s...

          I want to offer another perspective. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of people within the richest country in the world who live in third world or worse conditions is truly a tragedy. While there are international institutions, thousands of international NGOs, and billions of dollars focused on the severe problems of lack of safe water and sanitation in developing countries, we simply do not have the same level of attention or resources focused on these critical issues in the United States. The work of the Community Water Center is really unique and badly needed. I've worked at length on environmental justice issues in the United States, and documented how certain communities--primarily the poor and people of color--bear the brunt of toxic pollution. The same is true in developing country cities, an issue I've also worked on for decades, where it is the very poor who don't have access to the same subsidized municipal water as the middle class. We need to address water poverty and water inequity everywhere in the world. To term this an interim solution is a misnomer I think. Changing water policy and the practices of large agriculture in California will be a many decades effort. These communities need solutions now. Both need to be pursued in concert. And, solutions that were mostly used in developing countries (sink attached RO units--widely used in Asia in developing country cities by the middle class) are now filling a niche here in the US. I am not a huge fan of RO, but I do feel RO is well suited to deal with nitrate contamination, for which there are not a lot of good solutions. Best, Meena

          • Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

            Rick, Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you: 1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for...

            Rick,

            Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you:

            1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for many reasons.

            2. The capacity and ability of CWC to deliver on this project. Their background in mobilizing is good, but this is new teritory for them. Seeing their (lack of) interaction in the Q&A does generate doubt.

            But here are 2 questions for you:

            1. We are tapping into funds that are California specific. So they could not be used elsewhere. In this case, its not a choice of using funds here or somewhere else which maybe could be seen as more deserving. Even if we ignore Meena's perspective, shouldn't such funds being used in CA provide a great 'bang for the buck'?

            2. Why do you think this project would be a disaster for PWX?

            In fact, PWX provides a platform with SMS, mapping, and project verification to help track the implementation and operation of even household systems. The PWX network can provide support and feedback.

            If there is some serious pitfall PWX is heading into, please be more explicit. This is why the PWX process is great, your experience and insight (and that of so many peers with diverse experiences) may help avoid a trap.

            Finally, i think that even if the project does not succeed, PWX will record failed attempts, an activity sorely lacking the water sector. Failures provide a rich set of learnings if viewed in full context. Such transparency is not even imagined by the new momentum that is getting attention and funding in the sector. Right now all the focus is on failed projects with no context of who did them, when, and why. PWX is the only place a failure is not just a point on the map, but is put in context of the plan, the organization, the work attempted, and the jury is not a funder but a set of peers who care about fixing the entire process to change the outcome.

            Regards,
            Rajesh

            • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

              Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

              Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

                Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

                In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

                Cheers, Rick

                • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                  What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                  What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                  By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                  Cheers, Rick

                  Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                  Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

              In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

              Cheers, Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

              In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

              Cheers, Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

          Rick, Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you: 1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for...

          Rick,

          Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you:

          1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for many reasons.

          2. The capacity and ability of CWC to deliver on this project. Their background in mobilizing is good, but this is new teritory for them. Seeing their (lack of) interaction in the Q&A does generate doubt.

          But here are 2 questions for you:

          1. We are tapping into funds that are California specific. So they could not be used elsewhere. In this case, its not a choice of using funds here or somewhere else which maybe could be seen as more deserving. Even if we ignore Meena's perspective, shouldn't such funds being used in CA provide a great 'bang for the buck'?

          2. Why do you think this project would be a disaster for PWX?

          In fact, PWX provides a platform with SMS, mapping, and project verification to help track the implementation and operation of even household systems. The PWX network can provide support and feedback.

          If there is some serious pitfall PWX is heading into, please be more explicit. This is why the PWX process is great, your experience and insight (and that of so many peers with diverse experiences) may help avoid a trap.

          Finally, i think that even if the project does not succeed, PWX will record failed attempts, an activity sorely lacking the water sector. Failures provide a rich set of learnings if viewed in full context. Such transparency is not even imagined by the new momentum that is getting attention and funding in the sector. Right now all the focus is on failed projects with no context of who did them, when, and why. PWX is the only place a failure is not just a point on the map, but is put in context of the plan, the organization, the work attempted, and the jury is not a funder but a set of peers who care about fixing the entire process to change the outcome.

          Regards,
          Rajesh

          • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

              In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

              Cheers, Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

          In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

          Cheers, Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

        Sorry to say, but the proposed California project would be a disaster for the Peer Water Exchange. Cheers, Rick

        Sorry to say, but the proposed California project would be a disaster for the Peer Water Exchange.

        Cheers, Rick

        • Meena Palaniappan of Pacific Institute

          I want to offer another perspective. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of people within the richest country in the world who live in third world or worse conditions is truly a tragedy. While there are international institutions, thousands of international NGOs, and billions of dollars focused on the severe problems of lack of s...

          I want to offer another perspective. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of people within the richest country in the world who live in third world or worse conditions is truly a tragedy. While there are international institutions, thousands of international NGOs, and billions of dollars focused on the severe problems of lack of safe water and sanitation in developing countries, we simply do not have the same level of attention or resources focused on these critical issues in the United States. The work of the Community Water Center is really unique and badly needed. I've worked at length on environmental justice issues in the United States, and documented how certain communities--primarily the poor and people of color--bear the brunt of toxic pollution. The same is true in developing country cities, an issue I've also worked on for decades, where it is the very poor who don't have access to the same subsidized municipal water as the middle class. We need to address water poverty and water inequity everywhere in the world. To term this an interim solution is a misnomer I think. Changing water policy and the practices of large agriculture in California will be a many decades effort. These communities need solutions now. Both need to be pursued in concert. And, solutions that were mostly used in developing countries (sink attached RO units--widely used in Asia in developing country cities by the middle class) are now filling a niche here in the US. I am not a huge fan of RO, but I do feel RO is well suited to deal with nitrate contamination, for which there are not a lot of good solutions. Best, Meena

          • Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

            Rick, Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you: 1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for...

            Rick,

            Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you:

            1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for many reasons.

            2. The capacity and ability of CWC to deliver on this project. Their background in mobilizing is good, but this is new teritory for them. Seeing their (lack of) interaction in the Q&A does generate doubt.

            But here are 2 questions for you:

            1. We are tapping into funds that are California specific. So they could not be used elsewhere. In this case, its not a choice of using funds here or somewhere else which maybe could be seen as more deserving. Even if we ignore Meena's perspective, shouldn't such funds being used in CA provide a great 'bang for the buck'?

            2. Why do you think this project would be a disaster for PWX?

            In fact, PWX provides a platform with SMS, mapping, and project verification to help track the implementation and operation of even household systems. The PWX network can provide support and feedback.

            If there is some serious pitfall PWX is heading into, please be more explicit. This is why the PWX process is great, your experience and insight (and that of so many peers with diverse experiences) may help avoid a trap.

            Finally, i think that even if the project does not succeed, PWX will record failed attempts, an activity sorely lacking the water sector. Failures provide a rich set of learnings if viewed in full context. Such transparency is not even imagined by the new momentum that is getting attention and funding in the sector. Right now all the focus is on failed projects with no context of who did them, when, and why. PWX is the only place a failure is not just a point on the map, but is put in context of the plan, the organization, the work attempted, and the jury is not a funder but a set of peers who care about fixing the entire process to change the outcome.

            Regards,
            Rajesh

            • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

              Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

              Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

                Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

                In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

                Cheers, Rick

                • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                  What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                  What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                  By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                  Cheers, Rick

                  Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                  Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

              In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

              Cheers, Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

              In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

              Cheers, Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

          Rick, Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you: 1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for...

          Rick,

          Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you:

          1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for many reasons.

          2. The capacity and ability of CWC to deliver on this project. Their background in mobilizing is good, but this is new teritory for them. Seeing their (lack of) interaction in the Q&A does generate doubt.

          But here are 2 questions for you:

          1. We are tapping into funds that are California specific. So they could not be used elsewhere. In this case, its not a choice of using funds here or somewhere else which maybe could be seen as more deserving. Even if we ignore Meena's perspective, shouldn't such funds being used in CA provide a great 'bang for the buck'?

          2. Why do you think this project would be a disaster for PWX?

          In fact, PWX provides a platform with SMS, mapping, and project verification to help track the implementation and operation of even household systems. The PWX network can provide support and feedback.

          If there is some serious pitfall PWX is heading into, please be more explicit. This is why the PWX process is great, your experience and insight (and that of so many peers with diverse experiences) may help avoid a trap.

          Finally, i think that even if the project does not succeed, PWX will record failed attempts, an activity sorely lacking the water sector. Failures provide a rich set of learnings if viewed in full context. Such transparency is not even imagined by the new momentum that is getting attention and funding in the sector. Right now all the focus is on failed projects with no context of who did them, when, and why. PWX is the only place a failure is not just a point on the map, but is put in context of the plan, the organization, the work attempted, and the jury is not a funder but a set of peers who care about fixing the entire process to change the outcome.

          Regards,
          Rajesh

          • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

              In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

              Cheers, Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

          In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

          Cheers, Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Meena Palaniappan of Pacific Institute

        I want to offer another perspective. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of people within the richest country in the world who live in third world or worse conditions is truly a tragedy. While there are international institutions, thousands of international NGOs, and billions of dollars focused on the severe problems of lack of s...

        I want to offer another perspective. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of people within the richest country in the world who live in third world or worse conditions is truly a tragedy. While there are international institutions, thousands of international NGOs, and billions of dollars focused on the severe problems of lack of safe water and sanitation in developing countries, we simply do not have the same level of attention or resources focused on these critical issues in the United States. The work of the Community Water Center is really unique and badly needed. I've worked at length on environmental justice issues in the United States, and documented how certain communities--primarily the poor and people of color--bear the brunt of toxic pollution. The same is true in developing country cities, an issue I've also worked on for decades, where it is the very poor who don't have access to the same subsidized municipal water as the middle class. We need to address water poverty and water inequity everywhere in the world. To term this an interim solution is a misnomer I think. Changing water policy and the practices of large agriculture in California will be a many decades effort. These communities need solutions now. Both need to be pursued in concert. And, solutions that were mostly used in developing countries (sink attached RO units--widely used in Asia in developing country cities by the middle class) are now filling a niche here in the US. I am not a huge fan of RO, but I do feel RO is well suited to deal with nitrate contamination, for which there are not a lot of good solutions. Best, Meena

        • Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

          Rick, Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you: 1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for...

          Rick,

          Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you:

          1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for many reasons.

          2. The capacity and ability of CWC to deliver on this project. Their background in mobilizing is good, but this is new teritory for them. Seeing their (lack of) interaction in the Q&A does generate doubt.

          But here are 2 questions for you:

          1. We are tapping into funds that are California specific. So they could not be used elsewhere. In this case, its not a choice of using funds here or somewhere else which maybe could be seen as more deserving. Even if we ignore Meena's perspective, shouldn't such funds being used in CA provide a great 'bang for the buck'?

          2. Why do you think this project would be a disaster for PWX?

          In fact, PWX provides a platform with SMS, mapping, and project verification to help track the implementation and operation of even household systems. The PWX network can provide support and feedback.

          If there is some serious pitfall PWX is heading into, please be more explicit. This is why the PWX process is great, your experience and insight (and that of so many peers with diverse experiences) may help avoid a trap.

          Finally, i think that even if the project does not succeed, PWX will record failed attempts, an activity sorely lacking the water sector. Failures provide a rich set of learnings if viewed in full context. Such transparency is not even imagined by the new momentum that is getting attention and funding in the sector. Right now all the focus is on failed projects with no context of who did them, when, and why. PWX is the only place a failure is not just a point on the map, but is put in context of the plan, the organization, the work attempted, and the jury is not a funder but a set of peers who care about fixing the entire process to change the outcome.

          Regards,
          Rajesh

          • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

              In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

              Cheers, Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

          In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

          Cheers, Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

        Rick, Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you: 1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for...

        Rick,

        Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you:

        1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for many reasons.

        2. The capacity and ability of CWC to deliver on this project. Their background in mobilizing is good, but this is new teritory for them. Seeing their (lack of) interaction in the Q&A does generate doubt.

        But here are 2 questions for you:

        1. We are tapping into funds that are California specific. So they could not be used elsewhere. In this case, its not a choice of using funds here or somewhere else which maybe could be seen as more deserving. Even if we ignore Meena's perspective, shouldn't such funds being used in CA provide a great 'bang for the buck'?

        2. Why do you think this project would be a disaster for PWX?

        In fact, PWX provides a platform with SMS, mapping, and project verification to help track the implementation and operation of even household systems. The PWX network can provide support and feedback.

        If there is some serious pitfall PWX is heading into, please be more explicit. This is why the PWX process is great, your experience and insight (and that of so many peers with diverse experiences) may help avoid a trap.

        Finally, i think that even if the project does not succeed, PWX will record failed attempts, an activity sorely lacking the water sector. Failures provide a rich set of learnings if viewed in full context. Such transparency is not even imagined by the new momentum that is getting attention and funding in the sector. Right now all the focus is on failed projects with no context of who did them, when, and why. PWX is the only place a failure is not just a point on the map, but is put in context of the plan, the organization, the work attempted, and the jury is not a funder but a set of peers who care about fixing the entire process to change the outcome.

        Regards,
        Rajesh

        • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

          In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

          Cheers, Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

        Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

        Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

          In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

          Cheers, Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

        Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

        Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

        In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

        Cheers, Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

        What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

        What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

        By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

        Cheers, Rick

        Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

        Rick

    • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

      Sorry about shooting this down, but I just want to get the biggest "Bang for our Buck".

      Sorry about shooting this down, but I just want to get the biggest "Bang for our Buck".

      • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

        Sorry to say, but the proposed California project would be a disaster for the Peer Water Exchange. Cheers, Rick

        Sorry to say, but the proposed California project would be a disaster for the Peer Water Exchange.

        Cheers, Rick

        • Meena Palaniappan of Pacific Institute

          I want to offer another perspective. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of people within the richest country in the world who live in third world or worse conditions is truly a tragedy. While there are international institutions, thousands of international NGOs, and billions of dollars focused on the severe problems of lack of s...

          I want to offer another perspective. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of people within the richest country in the world who live in third world or worse conditions is truly a tragedy. While there are international institutions, thousands of international NGOs, and billions of dollars focused on the severe problems of lack of safe water and sanitation in developing countries, we simply do not have the same level of attention or resources focused on these critical issues in the United States. The work of the Community Water Center is really unique and badly needed. I've worked at length on environmental justice issues in the United States, and documented how certain communities--primarily the poor and people of color--bear the brunt of toxic pollution. The same is true in developing country cities, an issue I've also worked on for decades, where it is the very poor who don't have access to the same subsidized municipal water as the middle class. We need to address water poverty and water inequity everywhere in the world. To term this an interim solution is a misnomer I think. Changing water policy and the practices of large agriculture in California will be a many decades effort. These communities need solutions now. Both need to be pursued in concert. And, solutions that were mostly used in developing countries (sink attached RO units--widely used in Asia in developing country cities by the middle class) are now filling a niche here in the US. I am not a huge fan of RO, but I do feel RO is well suited to deal with nitrate contamination, for which there are not a lot of good solutions. Best, Meena

          • Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

            Rick, Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you: 1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for...

            Rick,

            Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you:

            1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for many reasons.

            2. The capacity and ability of CWC to deliver on this project. Their background in mobilizing is good, but this is new teritory for them. Seeing their (lack of) interaction in the Q&A does generate doubt.

            But here are 2 questions for you:

            1. We are tapping into funds that are California specific. So they could not be used elsewhere. In this case, its not a choice of using funds here or somewhere else which maybe could be seen as more deserving. Even if we ignore Meena's perspective, shouldn't such funds being used in CA provide a great 'bang for the buck'?

            2. Why do you think this project would be a disaster for PWX?

            In fact, PWX provides a platform with SMS, mapping, and project verification to help track the implementation and operation of even household systems. The PWX network can provide support and feedback.

            If there is some serious pitfall PWX is heading into, please be more explicit. This is why the PWX process is great, your experience and insight (and that of so many peers with diverse experiences) may help avoid a trap.

            Finally, i think that even if the project does not succeed, PWX will record failed attempts, an activity sorely lacking the water sector. Failures provide a rich set of learnings if viewed in full context. Such transparency is not even imagined by the new momentum that is getting attention and funding in the sector. Right now all the focus is on failed projects with no context of who did them, when, and why. PWX is the only place a failure is not just a point on the map, but is put in context of the plan, the organization, the work attempted, and the jury is not a funder but a set of peers who care about fixing the entire process to change the outcome.

            Regards,
            Rajesh

            • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

              Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

              Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

                Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

                In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

                Cheers, Rick

                • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                  What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                  What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                  By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                  Cheers, Rick

                  Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                  Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

              In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

              Cheers, Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

              In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

              Cheers, Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

          Rick, Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you: 1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for...

          Rick,

          Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you:

          1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for many reasons.

          2. The capacity and ability of CWC to deliver on this project. Their background in mobilizing is good, but this is new teritory for them. Seeing their (lack of) interaction in the Q&A does generate doubt.

          But here are 2 questions for you:

          1. We are tapping into funds that are California specific. So they could not be used elsewhere. In this case, its not a choice of using funds here or somewhere else which maybe could be seen as more deserving. Even if we ignore Meena's perspective, shouldn't such funds being used in CA provide a great 'bang for the buck'?

          2. Why do you think this project would be a disaster for PWX?

          In fact, PWX provides a platform with SMS, mapping, and project verification to help track the implementation and operation of even household systems. The PWX network can provide support and feedback.

          If there is some serious pitfall PWX is heading into, please be more explicit. This is why the PWX process is great, your experience and insight (and that of so many peers with diverse experiences) may help avoid a trap.

          Finally, i think that even if the project does not succeed, PWX will record failed attempts, an activity sorely lacking the water sector. Failures provide a rich set of learnings if viewed in full context. Such transparency is not even imagined by the new momentum that is getting attention and funding in the sector. Right now all the focus is on failed projects with no context of who did them, when, and why. PWX is the only place a failure is not just a point on the map, but is put in context of the plan, the organization, the work attempted, and the jury is not a funder but a set of peers who care about fixing the entire process to change the outcome.

          Regards,
          Rajesh

          • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

              In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

              Cheers, Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

          In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

          Cheers, Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Meena Palaniappan of Pacific Institute

        I want to offer another perspective. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of people within the richest country in the world who live in third world or worse conditions is truly a tragedy. While there are international institutions, thousands of international NGOs, and billions of dollars focused on the severe problems of lack of s...

        I want to offer another perspective. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of people within the richest country in the world who live in third world or worse conditions is truly a tragedy. While there are international institutions, thousands of international NGOs, and billions of dollars focused on the severe problems of lack of safe water and sanitation in developing countries, we simply do not have the same level of attention or resources focused on these critical issues in the United States. The work of the Community Water Center is really unique and badly needed. I've worked at length on environmental justice issues in the United States, and documented how certain communities--primarily the poor and people of color--bear the brunt of toxic pollution. The same is true in developing country cities, an issue I've also worked on for decades, where it is the very poor who don't have access to the same subsidized municipal water as the middle class. We need to address water poverty and water inequity everywhere in the world. To term this an interim solution is a misnomer I think. Changing water policy and the practices of large agriculture in California will be a many decades effort. These communities need solutions now. Both need to be pursued in concert. And, solutions that were mostly used in developing countries (sink attached RO units--widely used in Asia in developing country cities by the middle class) are now filling a niche here in the US. I am not a huge fan of RO, but I do feel RO is well suited to deal with nitrate contamination, for which there are not a lot of good solutions. Best, Meena

        • Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

          Rick, Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you: 1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for...

          Rick,

          Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you:

          1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for many reasons.

          2. The capacity and ability of CWC to deliver on this project. Their background in mobilizing is good, but this is new teritory for them. Seeing their (lack of) interaction in the Q&A does generate doubt.

          But here are 2 questions for you:

          1. We are tapping into funds that are California specific. So they could not be used elsewhere. In this case, its not a choice of using funds here or somewhere else which maybe could be seen as more deserving. Even if we ignore Meena's perspective, shouldn't such funds being used in CA provide a great 'bang for the buck'?

          2. Why do you think this project would be a disaster for PWX?

          In fact, PWX provides a platform with SMS, mapping, and project verification to help track the implementation and operation of even household systems. The PWX network can provide support and feedback.

          If there is some serious pitfall PWX is heading into, please be more explicit. This is why the PWX process is great, your experience and insight (and that of so many peers with diverse experiences) may help avoid a trap.

          Finally, i think that even if the project does not succeed, PWX will record failed attempts, an activity sorely lacking the water sector. Failures provide a rich set of learnings if viewed in full context. Such transparency is not even imagined by the new momentum that is getting attention and funding in the sector. Right now all the focus is on failed projects with no context of who did them, when, and why. PWX is the only place a failure is not just a point on the map, but is put in context of the plan, the organization, the work attempted, and the jury is not a funder but a set of peers who care about fixing the entire process to change the outcome.

          Regards,
          Rajesh

          • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

              In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

              Cheers, Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

          In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

          Cheers, Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

        Rick, Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you: 1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for...

        Rick,

        Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you:

        1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for many reasons.

        2. The capacity and ability of CWC to deliver on this project. Their background in mobilizing is good, but this is new teritory for them. Seeing their (lack of) interaction in the Q&A does generate doubt.

        But here are 2 questions for you:

        1. We are tapping into funds that are California specific. So they could not be used elsewhere. In this case, its not a choice of using funds here or somewhere else which maybe could be seen as more deserving. Even if we ignore Meena's perspective, shouldn't such funds being used in CA provide a great 'bang for the buck'?

        2. Why do you think this project would be a disaster for PWX?

        In fact, PWX provides a platform with SMS, mapping, and project verification to help track the implementation and operation of even household systems. The PWX network can provide support and feedback.

        If there is some serious pitfall PWX is heading into, please be more explicit. This is why the PWX process is great, your experience and insight (and that of so many peers with diverse experiences) may help avoid a trap.

        Finally, i think that even if the project does not succeed, PWX will record failed attempts, an activity sorely lacking the water sector. Failures provide a rich set of learnings if viewed in full context. Such transparency is not even imagined by the new momentum that is getting attention and funding in the sector. Right now all the focus is on failed projects with no context of who did them, when, and why. PWX is the only place a failure is not just a point on the map, but is put in context of the plan, the organization, the work attempted, and the jury is not a funder but a set of peers who care about fixing the entire process to change the outcome.

        Regards,
        Rajesh

        • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

          In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

          Cheers, Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

        Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

        Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

          In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

          Cheers, Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

        Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

        Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

        In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

        Cheers, Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

        What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

        What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

        By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

        Cheers, Rick

        Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

        Rick

    • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

      Sorry to say, but the proposed California project would be a disaster for the Peer Water Exchange. Cheers, Rick

      Sorry to say, but the proposed California project would be a disaster for the Peer Water Exchange.

      Cheers, Rick

      • Meena Palaniappan of Pacific Institute

        I want to offer another perspective. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of people within the richest country in the world who live in third world or worse conditions is truly a tragedy. While there are international institutions, thousands of international NGOs, and billions of dollars focused on the severe problems of lack of s...

        I want to offer another perspective. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of people within the richest country in the world who live in third world or worse conditions is truly a tragedy. While there are international institutions, thousands of international NGOs, and billions of dollars focused on the severe problems of lack of safe water and sanitation in developing countries, we simply do not have the same level of attention or resources focused on these critical issues in the United States. The work of the Community Water Center is really unique and badly needed. I've worked at length on environmental justice issues in the United States, and documented how certain communities--primarily the poor and people of color--bear the brunt of toxic pollution. The same is true in developing country cities, an issue I've also worked on for decades, where it is the very poor who don't have access to the same subsidized municipal water as the middle class. We need to address water poverty and water inequity everywhere in the world. To term this an interim solution is a misnomer I think. Changing water policy and the practices of large agriculture in California will be a many decades effort. These communities need solutions now. Both need to be pursued in concert. And, solutions that were mostly used in developing countries (sink attached RO units--widely used in Asia in developing country cities by the middle class) are now filling a niche here in the US. I am not a huge fan of RO, but I do feel RO is well suited to deal with nitrate contamination, for which there are not a lot of good solutions. Best, Meena

        • Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

          Rick, Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you: 1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for...

          Rick,

          Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you:

          1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for many reasons.

          2. The capacity and ability of CWC to deliver on this project. Their background in mobilizing is good, but this is new teritory for them. Seeing their (lack of) interaction in the Q&A does generate doubt.

          But here are 2 questions for you:

          1. We are tapping into funds that are California specific. So they could not be used elsewhere. In this case, its not a choice of using funds here or somewhere else which maybe could be seen as more deserving. Even if we ignore Meena's perspective, shouldn't such funds being used in CA provide a great 'bang for the buck'?

          2. Why do you think this project would be a disaster for PWX?

          In fact, PWX provides a platform with SMS, mapping, and project verification to help track the implementation and operation of even household systems. The PWX network can provide support and feedback.

          If there is some serious pitfall PWX is heading into, please be more explicit. This is why the PWX process is great, your experience and insight (and that of so many peers with diverse experiences) may help avoid a trap.

          Finally, i think that even if the project does not succeed, PWX will record failed attempts, an activity sorely lacking the water sector. Failures provide a rich set of learnings if viewed in full context. Such transparency is not even imagined by the new momentum that is getting attention and funding in the sector. Right now all the focus is on failed projects with no context of who did them, when, and why. PWX is the only place a failure is not just a point on the map, but is put in context of the plan, the organization, the work attempted, and the jury is not a funder but a set of peers who care about fixing the entire process to change the outcome.

          Regards,
          Rajesh

          • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

            Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

              Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

              In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

              Cheers, Rick

              • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

                What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

                By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

                Cheers, Rick

                Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

                Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

          In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

          Cheers, Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

        Rick, Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you: 1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for...

        Rick,

        Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you:

        1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for many reasons.

        2. The capacity and ability of CWC to deliver on this project. Their background in mobilizing is good, but this is new teritory for them. Seeing their (lack of) interaction in the Q&A does generate doubt.

        But here are 2 questions for you:

        1. We are tapping into funds that are California specific. So they could not be used elsewhere. In this case, its not a choice of using funds here or somewhere else which maybe could be seen as more deserving. Even if we ignore Meena's perspective, shouldn't such funds being used in CA provide a great 'bang for the buck'?

        2. Why do you think this project would be a disaster for PWX?

        In fact, PWX provides a platform with SMS, mapping, and project verification to help track the implementation and operation of even household systems. The PWX network can provide support and feedback.

        If there is some serious pitfall PWX is heading into, please be more explicit. This is why the PWX process is great, your experience and insight (and that of so many peers with diverse experiences) may help avoid a trap.

        Finally, i think that even if the project does not succeed, PWX will record failed attempts, an activity sorely lacking the water sector. Failures provide a rich set of learnings if viewed in full context. Such transparency is not even imagined by the new momentum that is getting attention and funding in the sector. Right now all the focus is on failed projects with no context of who did them, when, and why. PWX is the only place a failure is not just a point on the map, but is put in context of the plan, the organization, the work attempted, and the jury is not a funder but a set of peers who care about fixing the entire process to change the outcome.

        Regards,
        Rajesh

        • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

          In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

          Cheers, Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

        Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

        Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

          In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

          Cheers, Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

        Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

        Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

        In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

        Cheers, Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

        What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

        What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

        By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

        Cheers, Rick

        Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

        Rick

    • Meena Palaniappan of Pacific Institute

      I want to offer another perspective. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of people within the richest country in the world who live in third world or worse conditions is truly a tragedy. While there are international institutions, thousands of international NGOs, and billions of dollars focused on the severe problems of lack of s...

      I want to offer another perspective. The fact that there are hundreds of thousands of people within the richest country in the world who live in third world or worse conditions is truly a tragedy. While there are international institutions, thousands of international NGOs, and billions of dollars focused on the severe problems of lack of safe water and sanitation in developing countries, we simply do not have the same level of attention or resources focused on these critical issues in the United States. The work of the Community Water Center is really unique and badly needed. I've worked at length on environmental justice issues in the United States, and documented how certain communities--primarily the poor and people of color--bear the brunt of toxic pollution. The same is true in developing country cities, an issue I've also worked on for decades, where it is the very poor who don't have access to the same subsidized municipal water as the middle class. We need to address water poverty and water inequity everywhere in the world. To term this an interim solution is a misnomer I think. Changing water policy and the practices of large agriculture in California will be a many decades effort. These communities need solutions now. Both need to be pursued in concert. And, solutions that were mostly used in developing countries (sink attached RO units--widely used in Asia in developing country cities by the middle class) are now filling a niche here in the US. I am not a huge fan of RO, but I do feel RO is well suited to deal with nitrate contamination, for which there are not a lot of good solutions. Best, Meena

      • Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

        Rick, Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you: 1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for...

        Rick,

        Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you:

        1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for many reasons.

        2. The capacity and ability of CWC to deliver on this project. Their background in mobilizing is good, but this is new teritory for them. Seeing their (lack of) interaction in the Q&A does generate doubt.

        But here are 2 questions for you:

        1. We are tapping into funds that are California specific. So they could not be used elsewhere. In this case, its not a choice of using funds here or somewhere else which maybe could be seen as more deserving. Even if we ignore Meena's perspective, shouldn't such funds being used in CA provide a great 'bang for the buck'?

        2. Why do you think this project would be a disaster for PWX?

        In fact, PWX provides a platform with SMS, mapping, and project verification to help track the implementation and operation of even household systems. The PWX network can provide support and feedback.

        If there is some serious pitfall PWX is heading into, please be more explicit. This is why the PWX process is great, your experience and insight (and that of so many peers with diverse experiences) may help avoid a trap.

        Finally, i think that even if the project does not succeed, PWX will record failed attempts, an activity sorely lacking the water sector. Failures provide a rich set of learnings if viewed in full context. Such transparency is not even imagined by the new momentum that is getting attention and funding in the sector. Right now all the focus is on failed projects with no context of who did them, when, and why. PWX is the only place a failure is not just a point on the map, but is put in context of the plan, the organization, the work attempted, and the jury is not a funder but a set of peers who care about fixing the entire process to change the outcome.

        Regards,
        Rajesh

        • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

          Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

            Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

            In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

            Cheers, Rick

            • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

              What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

              By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

              Cheers, Rick

              Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

              Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

          In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

          Cheers, Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

        Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

        Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

          In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

          Cheers, Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

        Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

        Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

        In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

        Cheers, Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

        What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

        What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

        By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

        Cheers, Rick

        Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

        Rick

    • Rajesh Shah of Peer Water Exchange

      Rick, Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you: 1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for...

      Rick,

      Thanks for all the research and sharing your candid opinions. A couple of thoughts where i agree with you:

      1. RO systems are hugely wasteful of water and energy and without good maintenance can pose problems. Happy to investigate options both short- and medium-term. Don't think we can do larger scale community systems in US for many reasons.

      2. The capacity and ability of CWC to deliver on this project. Their background in mobilizing is good, but this is new teritory for them. Seeing their (lack of) interaction in the Q&A does generate doubt.

      But here are 2 questions for you:

      1. We are tapping into funds that are California specific. So they could not be used elsewhere. In this case, its not a choice of using funds here or somewhere else which maybe could be seen as more deserving. Even if we ignore Meena's perspective, shouldn't such funds being used in CA provide a great 'bang for the buck'?

      2. Why do you think this project would be a disaster for PWX?

      In fact, PWX provides a platform with SMS, mapping, and project verification to help track the implementation and operation of even household systems. The PWX network can provide support and feedback.

      If there is some serious pitfall PWX is heading into, please be more explicit. This is why the PWX process is great, your experience and insight (and that of so many peers with diverse experiences) may help avoid a trap.

      Finally, i think that even if the project does not succeed, PWX will record failed attempts, an activity sorely lacking the water sector. Failures provide a rich set of learnings if viewed in full context. Such transparency is not even imagined by the new momentum that is getting attention and funding in the sector. Right now all the focus is on failed projects with no context of who did them, when, and why. PWX is the only place a failure is not just a point on the map, but is put in context of the plan, the organization, the work attempted, and the jury is not a funder but a set of peers who care about fixing the entire process to change the outcome.

      Regards,
      Rajesh

      • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

        Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

        Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

          Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

          In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

          Cheers, Rick

          • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

            What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

            By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

            Cheers, Rick

            Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

            Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

        Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

        Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

        In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

        Cheers, Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

        What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

        What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

        By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

        Cheers, Rick

        Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

        Rick

    • Roger Kallock of Team Blue

      Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeabl...

      Given the degree of passion exhibited by many of the reviewers, this proposal is being given a well deserved review. However, the very political nature of water related issues in CA, the high press visibility to be expected, and the limited experience of CWC makes me strongly urge the establishment of a project advisory board. Knowledgeable water, project management and even independent CA political environment experts to oversee the planning and execution of this project should be welcomed by all involved and decrease probabilities that this project fails. While failure may be a learning experience internal to PWX/BPN, failure given broad press coverage could produce expected negative impact on future funding, etc.

      • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

        Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

        Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

        In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

        Cheers, Rick

        • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

          What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

          By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

          Cheers, Rick

          Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

          Rick

      • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

        What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

        What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

        By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

        Cheers, Rick

        Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

        Rick

    • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

      Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered...

      Ok, it would not necessarily be a disaster, but I am quite convinced that the proposed system in California would be a much less cost effective investment, due in large part to the extensive and complex legal, regulatory, environmental, and technical requirements in California (and the U.S. overall) that would have to be strictly adhered to, compared to relatively low-cost systems such as in South East Asia or Africa. Do we really want to spend so much money (compared to other previous PWX projects) on this single site?

      In any event, before any decisions are made, a detailed cost assessment should be carried out, including all aspects and costs of the proposed project, including technical, financial, legal, environmental, willingness to co-pay on the part of the beneficiaries, long term operation, maintenance, repair and replacement costs. Roger's suggestion about a advisory panel is a good idea.

      Cheers, Rick

      • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

        What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

        What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

        By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

        Cheers, Rick

        Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

        Rick

    • Rick McGowan of Team Blue

      What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal. By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, wh...

      What about latrines? This is a major community issue that is all too often ignored. I think that it was not mentioned in the initial draft proposal.

      By the way, you should call Bill Gates to find out about his big bucks family latrine program. He could probably pony up a few spare bucks to co-finance family and community latrines, which would like have a major improvement to community health in this proposed community. Don't leave it out. All for now.

      Cheers, Rick

      Ok, all for me now, I want to watch all the elections.

      Rick

  • Rating: 5

    review by Blue Planet Network

    Good project and the organization looks like its ready to implement.

    However, in terms of PWX the organization has not shown interest in the peer review and sharing and learning process. Many q's are not answered.

    Since the metrics in M&E are not spelled out, its not clear what the plans are to report regularly on progress as the filters are installed. In California there should be no problem in reporting with GPS and SMS and tracking every installation. And long-term monitoring of filter maintenance etc.

    Also, handling of the waste - why should it go into sewage when it can go to lawns and kitchen gardens? A few questions are unanswered.

    So the doubts are more about the process, not about the intended outcome.

  • Rating: 8

    review by El Porvenir

    I think this project is important and that the group is doing a number of things well:
    1. Working to address the root cause.
    2. Working closely with the people affected by the drinking water issue.
    3. Creating the simplest solution possible that needs little follow up.
    4. Involving local businesses and civic groups.
    5. Working to have the greatest impact.

    I would like to see buy-in from the people that will be using the filters, some amount contributed.

    I also might have ranked this higher had the questions posted a week ago been answered. I apologize that I couldn't wait longer to rate this project, but I am headed out of town.

    Best of luck to you!

  • Rating: 7

    review by Global Women's Water Initiative

    HI there,

    I love that this project is being done in the US - further supporting the fact that the water crisis is worldwide.

    I would like to know more about the choice of technologies and if there have been other alternative technologies considered. I'm not a huge fan of reverse-osmosis because of the amount of water wasted during treatment. Are there other options?

    Good luck!
    gemma

  • Rating: 9

    review by Pacific Institute

    Nitrate contamination and its impacts on marginalized communities in the richest country and region in the world is truly one of the untold tragedies of agriculture in America. The Pacific Institute has worked with CWC on a report on the costs of nitrate contamination (http://www.pacinst.org/reports/nitrate_contamination/). Families living with nitrate contaminated water are often forced to purchase private water supplies at higher costs than public supplies.Treating for nitrate contamination is an expensive venture and the small water suppliers that service these areas don't have the financial capacity to install RO systems. The use of household scale RO is very common among the middle and upper classes in developing country cities in Asia. It is interesting that this type of solution becomes an appropriate fit in these situations. I think the focus on institutions and providing treated water for children in schools is critical.

  • Rating: 3

    review by Team Blue

    As I said before, I think that spending money building water and sanitation infrastructure in the U.S. is not the best use of PWX financing. You can get a much greater rate of return on investment in developing countries as we are doing already.

  • Rating: 9

    review by The Samburu Project

    This seems like a very worthwhile project. It serves a marginalized segment of the population--one which many in California prefer not to consider. I'm interested to see what data the monitoring and evaluation yield, and how this project blends with future long-term, larger-scale efforts.

    Recommendation: fund.

  • Rating: 7

    review by Drink Local. Drink Tap.

Name Status Completion Date Final Cost
Monson Household POU Filter Installation completed Dec 2013 0
Arvin Union School District POU filter installation in_progress Jul 2014 27,000
Seville Community Water Vending Machine in_progress Dec 2014 50,000
Community Action Partnership of Kern Head Start Centers POU Filter project completed Dec 2013 0